Curse

Amity and Truth · Sep 25, 2006, 04:42 PM // 16:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elanshi

Why don't all you people whining about Monks just roll one yourself?

Because most allready did that and know from experience how bad most monks suck.

Trvth Jvstice · Sep 25, 2006, 04:50 PM // 16:50

I haven't had any problems using healing breeze in the areas I usually monk. I don't use it in areas where enchants are removed. I don't use it when orison would have sufficed (dwaana's kiss if they're hexed).

There have been many times, when multiple players are taking steady dmg in the pug I'm monking, when I would cast hb on one member to keep them at nearly full health so I could concentrate on the rest of the group. I wouldn't do that if they were taking heavy dmg, but it just makes it easier to manage when there's a lot of people taking steady dmg.

I also use vigorous spirit on people taking steady, but not heavy dmg. I know a lot of people would advise me to use healing seed instead of breeze or v. spirit, but h. seed has a terribly long recharge time, like 30 seconds I think.

All throughout this forum you see people stating hb is bad for a healing monk, but there have been many times it has kept me alive along with healing touch while I ran into the group to do a quick heal to keep a party member or two alive.

Also a few people here have stated that with proper placement, a monk shouldn't worry about self heals. So are you saying that you're just going to let a party member die to keep from being attacked? When your pug gets spread out- and it will, you sometimes have to run into aggro range to keep a member or two alive.

Heal party is also a great skill for when your party is taking heavy degen. Just wait till everyone's at about 3/4 life then cast it. Also it's great for when someone has ran far away from the group and is taking dmg. Sure, they might deserve to die, but if I can keep someone alive even though they're being dumb, why not?

P.S. I primarily use my monk in THK, my fav mission. With pugs, it's a different mission every time

Stemnin · Sep 25, 2006, 05:19 PM // 17:19

I henched most of factions playing my monk in the first weekend, then i stopped playing him, played war, necro, ranger, ele, rit through factions.. always brought a self heal, heal sig, taste of death, troll unguent... always needed to use them.

But really it is frightening, someone commented on monks that are eager to join, theyre mostly like that, but the ones to watch for are the ones that say.. "monk lfg that has mm or another monk".. you know the other monk hafts to do the efficient work.

HB hasnt been on my skillbar since i killed my doppleganger and had a stab at playing 55, and HP is great in factions, just dont need to spam as some do. Heaven's delight..? As if heal area on a monk wasnt bad enough IMO.

Another thing, heal monk lfg is not a boon prot!! Playing my rit, I was using a weapon spell build.. resilient weapon down the drain, atleast i was using attuned was songkai.

Alleji · Sep 25, 2006, 05:46 PM // 17:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tremere

3 letters :

WoH.

2 letters:

HH

GG

Heal party is actually the most efficient heal in the game (seed/hands/mark of prot excluded) but it's certainly not a spam skill. Having it on your bar = good. Having 1-target heals on your bar along with it = good as well. But I bet your average HP-loving monk never frequents these forums, so why are we collectively bitching at them?

Arwen Shiningstar · Sep 25, 2006, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hyaon

Oh boy, when I last depended on a monk pug with my MM, after doing the previous missions with good old henchies and guildies, I raged! Every time I did botm, I relied on the pug monk to heal me properly in order to keep the minions alive in combat....well he/she/it casted just healing breeze EVERY time, well it's good regen right...well it was regen 7...Thanks dude =/ So everyone died \o\ I have nothing against breeze, just if youre a monk for gods sake make it 9 regen ¬_¬ But it is a problem, most pug monks dont seem to use instant heals with divine stacked like woh, very annoying.

Don't rely on the PUG monk to heal you if you want to spam BOTM. I play MM all the time I bring my own heals and take care of myself. I bring breeze and heal area. Heal area gives you a nice big heal and if your minions are around you they get an extra heal. Energy is never a problem I have with my necro so using this skill shouldn't be a problem. It allows me to spam BOTM whenever I wish with out burdening the busy monk. A lot the time I stand in the middle of the all the casters and we all get healed. I guess it’s because I usually play monk and can relate better to the monk position. I like OoB. I hear ppl dissing it but I never run out of energy. In a pinch that extra energy boost comes in handy. I also usually bring both of the healing sigs (rejuvenation and devotion). As far as dissing HB and HP wow. As long as you use them wisely they are great heals. I will probably get called a Noob for this post but thats ok because I always get asked to come heal and get complimented on missions and thats all that really matters.

explodemyheart · Sep 25, 2006, 07:58 PM // 19:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas.knbk

What pisses ME off is Monks with W as secondary prof telling me it's better than my mo/me because of bonneties. Or the monks saying "I only have monks skills on my bar" and when I ask them why no e-management they say "so I can focus on healing more" often followed by a "you noob". In nightfall we're going to see a lot of monks without a second profession thinking they're uber leet and e-management is for pussys

I almost never carry any actual energy management skills on my bar. I can carry a full healing bar and still be fine for energy. I often roll my monk into missions as Mo/W. You can manage energy without skills that give you energy, you just have to know how to do it.

fatmouse · Sep 25, 2006, 08:11 PM // 20:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas.knbk

What pisses ME off is Monks with W as secondary prof telling me it's better than my mo/me because of bonneties. Or the monks saying "I only have monks skills on my bar" and when I ask them why no e-management they say "so I can focus on healing more" often followed by a "you noob". In nightfall we're going to see a lot of monks without a second profession thinking they're uber leet and e-management is for pussys

I'm Mo/W so I don't need to go to Senji's when I want to farm, you have plenty of energy as a pure heal monk. You think they would make a profession that is crippled without a particular secondary? Every other class is fine managing their own energy, so is monk. Only gimmick builds need e-management.

Aejorii · Sep 25, 2006, 08:11 PM // 20:11

E-management is less important in pve because you can stop after a fight and rest up (this is not so in pvp). Although, whenever I do monk in PvE, I always bring one just incase. There are some builds out there that do not rely on energy management, such as WoH builds, as they require less energy to play anyhow.

fatmouse · Sep 25, 2006, 08:22 PM // 20:22

Well yes this is clearly only related to pve monking. I can only remember a single time I've asked my party to 'rest up' - when I was the only monk in the energy drain room of dragons lair (they didn't listen, but it still worked out). Usually I'm at full energy and waiting for everyone else to go.

saphir · Sep 25, 2006, 09:38 PM // 21:38

I love PUG monking!
I never feel more alive in this game then when I actually have to make split second decisions, dealing with my mistakes, and testing my split second reflexes in mouse clicking and keyboard pounding =)

..maybe I'm just a GW masochist?

I don't usually monk for missions these days because they're a bit boring.. I never had a really good guild.. only those "omg, we need a monk! hurry, stop what you're doing and come monk for your guild", or the guild's w/ fresh faces that you're embarrassed to be in the same guild w/. The thing about guilds is sometimes you feel obligated to be there 100% of the time, or sometimes they have specific builds they'd like you to run, but most of all they can be too effecient and you can be bored out of your mind as a monk!

Anyway, it's never right to make sweeping generalizations such as HP or HB is always bad, or mending sucks, or OMG, how can a healing monk be mo/w!? There is always a time and place for most skills out there.
While I never use mending, and 99% of the time don't carry HP, I have found heal party to be very useful in b/p groups (those rangers usually know how to avoid damage, drink their troll ungent like a good little boy or girl, and run/uses stances when necessary). HP is also a neccessity in the elite missions w/ those annoying area/environment things that can throw -9 degen on an entire party. But mostly I find the 15 energy hit of a blanket party heal to be not only wasteful but SLOOOOW. heal party has a long cast time, and I cry when I see a monk who spams it in UW. It's very helpful as a backup heal on the chaos planes w/ the mesmer degen, but against spike damage, by the time you finish casting HP, those who needed healing are likely dead.

HB I always bring, but there's a difference between monks who are mindless skill spammers and think and reason before casting a heal. HB is good for areas that aren't heavy on enchant stripping/shattering. HB is good for an ele who knows how to stay in back and when to run from mobs that is only taking minimal non-spike damage. HB is good as downtime self heal when you have plenty of energy and aren't in enchant shattering range. HB is good vs the occasional degen or keeping a player at a fixed level of health (not losing much but not gaining much either) while you charge up your energy or wait for a skill recharge.

HB is NOT good for - casting when your eles or monks are being spiked by enemy eles, when you are surrounded by enchant shattering mesmers, when you need a fast heal and don't have time to wait for healing breeze to cast, when you are with range of such spirits as nature's renewal.

Good pug monking IMO is all about knowing when and why to cast your heals & knowing how to stay out of trouble. One very simple and basic energy management skill for PVE is simply to not stand there and act like a tank, wasting all your skills healing your self. All too often I've had second monks in my FOW groups who just stand there while being torn apart by 2 shadow warriors, spamming prot spirit and healing touch. Then I'm stuck keeping the other monk alive, protecting/healing the rest of the casters, healing the tank and trying to mitigate damage from SS due to everyone being all clustered around the tanking monk.

Because I monk exclusively for UW/FOW these days, I run a sort of hybrid heal/prot (16 heal/13 div/9 prot) set up for worst case scenarios (other monk drops/sucks/55 leech and strength based tanks). I consider sprint my best self heal and energy management rolled into one - gets me out of trouble, loses aggro if the mobs turn on me, I can run then cast instead of wasting a heal on myself then having to wait for it to recharge, can run in and spike heal a war then run back out, can dodge fireballs, chase after leeroys or panicked casters. Seriously, the less time/energy/skill recharge you have to waste healing yourself, the more energy and charged up heals you will have.

I've also dropped orison a while back in favor of ROF for my self heal. The only problem w/ rof is that it's an enchant so enchant shatter areas I cast it right before someone is about to get hit. Where as orison is not to great at outhealing spikes, ROF will at least keep the current health from going any lower.

I run essence bond as my energy management, but you have to know when to take it off or put it on, and on who. It's not the best skill for all circumstances, but it's very useful when you're the only monk left in a group 7 in uw/fow. Although I'm am curious to experiment w/ /me or /n energy management skills a lot of other monks use.

I've always equipped a running or damage avoidance skill on my characters whenever I can probably due to my early days as an E/R concerned about my survival w/ my al hench groups.

Remember, a dead monk casts no heals =)

Maria The Princess · Sep 26, 2006, 12:55 AM // 00:55

when I PuG as a monk, i ALWAYS have manta of recall and a monk henchie. I dont lik erelying on human monks, and i know that a henchie might do the job better then any other player.

manta of recall is the best energuy managment i know. with my play style i never have energy problems, and i dont have to rely on PuG necro to BR me.

Former Ruling · Sep 26, 2006, 01:16 AM // 01:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

Though monk is a very popular class, it is underestimated by many. It takes a lot of feeling and practice to become experienced at it. To become an expert you need to know all about this class, energy management, timing, effective builds, flexibility, dexterity, positioning, priotities, insight, etc etc

There are a good number of monks out there, but not as many are as skilled as you would like them to be.

PvE Monking takes mostly none of that stuff, I can say from experience.

Mostly the skill bar is the only problem in PvE - The monk will blow all his energy on 2-3 Heal Partys or Breezes and sit there for 5 minutes spamming he has 0 energy.

If you have a good N00b to decent player ratio on your team, Monking in PvE isnt that hard - I hardly have to ever use anything more than Orison of Healing except in those areas you know you have to use something more, like a Heal Other if they are serious low. Unless we have leeroys I usually dont let anyone die or anything, and get complimented.

Alot different than PvP. Where I basically..Lets just say I never monk for GvGs.

Age · Sep 26, 2006, 01:43 AM // 01:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Former Ruling

And give them the skill "Heal Party" so he'll blow through the energy in aminute and sit at 0.

EDIT: Heal Party is an awesome monk spell for PvE, I'm not knocking it, I carry it on healing monk pve builds. But These people, and AI, cannot handle when to use it.

Healing Monks in GvG use to or 8vs8.That is if you don't have E/Mo to do it for you.The thing with some of these Monks and I am one becuase I group with pugs.These Monks didn't learn how to Monk properly so there are bad Monks out there and doing it in Factions for the first time is not a good idea.It is far better to get one the slow learned in Prophecies.

Kha · Sep 26, 2006, 02:05 AM // 02:05

I find it funny that people think e-management is all about having that ONE perfect skill in your build that gives you energy. If I'm not let into a group because I don't have a mesmer energy stealing skill in my skillbar, then that's their loss and not mine. I, like others who have posted in this thread and many more in the game, use solely monk skills when I play.

It's not about having one skill that gives you energy when you need it. That's nice and all, but what is really important is knowing how to manage your energy with your monk skills so that you can keep your party alive and not burn through your 40+ energy like a fool. You have to learn when to cast certain spells and when not to, when to risk getting into the aggro bubble of the enemy and when to stay back just a little more, and most importantly when to let that annoying warrior that clicks every weapon set die because he needs to learn a lesson... uh... I didn't say that. I've never let someone die on purpose, I swear!

Tachyon · Sep 26, 2006, 02:46 AM // 02:46

I'm really hated in PUGS when I'm playing as my monk. I keep getting spam in the chat saying "WTF heal me" or "why'd you let me die n00b".

It get's even better when I point out that my monk, Triumph Dolosmite, is a smiter and not a protection or healing monk. I'd have thought her name would have given some clue as to her main job.

Sinborn · Sep 26, 2006, 03:18 AM // 03:18

For twitchy finger monks, you can always push them towards Glyph of Renewal/Divine Spirit spammers. Gets all the jitters out and usually gets the job done. Unfortunately, most crappy monks never make it to Perdition Rock. Ahh, THK, you're a wonderful filter.

Trvth Jvstice · Sep 26, 2006, 05:16 AM // 05:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azagoth

I'm really hated in PUGS when I'm playing as my monk. I keep getting spam in the chat saying "WTF heal me" or "why'd you let me die n00b".

It get's even better when I point out that my monk, Triumph Dolosmite, is a smiter and not a protection or healing monk. I'd have thought her name would have given some clue as to her main job.

I don't know if you're kidding or not

But you do let your pug know before you start that you're Smite right? hope so

Naaaa you gotta be kidding

Sinborn · Sep 26, 2006, 05:51 AM // 05:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trvth Jvstice

I don't know if you're kidding or not

But you do let your pug know before you start that you're Smite right? hope so

Naaaa you gotta be kidding

"Insert random Pro-smiter line here."

Rera · Sep 26, 2006, 06:55 AM // 06:55

PvE monking is easy enough to not require dedicated emgt skills or even a full skillbar. I roll with just WoH and a res if I can get away with it.

If you're PUGing and don't need an elite, bring Unyielding Aura. That way you can keep the scrubs on a leash. If they die from being stupid, res them with Aura. If they start being stupid again, cancel Aura.

Zui · Sep 26, 2006, 06:59 AM // 06:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rera

If you're PUGing and don't need an elite, bring Unyielding Aura. That way you can keep the scrubs on a leash. If they die from being stupid, res them with Aura. If they start being stupid again, cancel Aura.

That made me laugh.